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Money: A Sign of Greater Virtues?
Posted by socon on September 24, 2007
“Real women love rich men not for their money, but for their qualities that brought that money.”
This post was inspired by an article entitled Rich Man and Russian Brides: Poor-Guy-Good-Girl Test Failed over at Natalie’s blog. The basic premise behind this article is that there exists a strong correlation between a Man’s material wealth, and his possession of greater qualities like intelligence, competence, “virility”, “vitality” and a “great personality”.
I’ll be specifically addressing the (supposed) correlation between Money and these Greater Qualities in this post; and I’ll be discussing some further issues in Part 2.
(The context of this article is, of course, that of Western Men seeking Russian/FSU Wives, but I think the issues can be generalised fairly easily.)
In her article, Natalie tells us that…
“[Material wealth is] Just one more Secondary Sexual Characteristic for a Homo Sapiens. [...] social success is no substitute to other Virile Virtues, – it is nothing but an essential[??] [...] evidence of them… Like lion’s mane and rooster’s spurs used aptly to overcome other males, it indicates vitality [...]”
Not necessarily. Why? Well… let’s start by talking about Serious Wealth.
Serious Wealth has two main sources: Inheritance and Entrepreneurship.
Now… Entrepreneurship almost never starts before age 35, so the majority of budding entrepreneurs would not have accumulated serious wealth before the age of at least 40. Given that the median age of Men seeking FSU Women is 37, by using material wealth as evidence of greater “vitality”, what one has effectively done is…
[a] Eliminated over 50% of Men [all those under 40] who do have the “vitality” to generate serious wealth (or which is supposedly indicated by serious wealth) but have not accumulated it yet.* ; and
[b] Given a free pass to an even larger proportion of Men [almost all the rich ones under 40 and a good proportion of those older…] who have “family money”.. i.e. wealthy primarily due to Inheritance and not significant efforts on their own part… which I’m sure you’ll agree is not (necessarily) an indicator of any greater qualities.
[*Of course I assume here that they do, nevertheless, have ADEQUATE resources to maintain a family.]
Now, lets take a More Middle Class Example…
Here, the issue of REAL WEALTH vs. PERCEIVED WEALTH comes strongly into play…
This best illustrated using an example (and I’ll use American currency throughout for simplicity…) Take two Western Guys, John and Steve. John earns $ 30 000 a year, and Steve earns double that, $ 60 000 a year…
John buys himself a $ 50 000 car [on some residual plan that takes a huge chunk out of his salary every month, plus will bite him in the ass later on.]
Bling, Bling.
Steve, being more responsible, buys a much more modest $ 35 000 car. Steve’s excess income goes into savings, investments, property, whatever. John meanwhile gets further into debt buying more Bling… designer clothes, etc.
Now John and Steve goes to Russia to woo the some lovely Natasha, Svetlana, Olga, or whoever. (John with his not-yet-paid-for designer clothes, and pictures of his $50k car in tow… ) Now the punch-line…
Steve is actually both WEALTHIER and (more importantly) more MATURE, SENSIBLE and RESPONSIBLE than John, but is unlikely to be perceived as such.
I should add that, in the West including the U.S. this behaviour [John's] is more the norm than the exception… & thus apparent material wealth becomes a very poor indicator of actual wealth [in this earnings bracket], let alone greater qualities.
(And yes, this story is a tad silly, but I think it does effectively illustrate the point.)
This situation may also be exacerbated by the backgrounds of the individuals concerned… suppose these guys are both professionals in their late 20’s or early 30’s; and John comes from a much wealthier family than Steve…
Even if Steve is smarter, more hardworking, earning more – he will have issues like paying off student loans, taking care of parents, etc… while John’s education, first car, first apartment even may have been wholly or partly financed by Daddy.
I’ll be writing more on this in a while, so please do stay tuned 
Your comments & suggestions, and (constructive) criticism are most welcome.
(To Be Continued in Part 2)
russianlove said
Alright. Yes to most of it. And by the way, I like the tone of your blog. You seem to be a stable personality of good character who searches for the typical Western/Eurasian traditional union.
I already know your position on the utter disrespect of Eurasians for prostitution and am impressed at your level of general life knowledge and courtesy.
Further, it can be nauseating to post direct comments to a site’s author only to have them consistently entirely ignored. This too has absolutely nothing to do with respect and is in no way the action of a true gentlemen. There is no elegance in talking to a wall.
So, I digress…
Now about the paso’s(money) and in anticipation of all the comments which will surely follow from those who will surely whine about the “they only ever love you for your money” I leave my own two cents.
Wealth … the evidence of successful life interaction and dependability and so on.
Yes. However, regarding the numbers which you use, keep in mind that the general value system in Russia allows for much more modest numbers due to a much higher traditional value system. In other words, having potential and doing an effective and modest job without all the bells and whistles from within the context of a happy relationship, marriage and family is much, much more important.
Being consistently reliable and a good husband, friend and lover is much more important. So, please exercise some perspective with regard the numbers in the West and Eurasia regarding what is actual wealth.
Most “good” girls anywhere I’ve met them are much more interested that your good character comes without the usual Holiday Inn Surprises… womanizer, alcoholic, drugee along the way of life, a man of absolutely no direction or career purpose lost to his true place in the world and perpetual job/career hopper.
There are also men who require a purpose in order to “get their game face on”. And if anyone fits this, it is me.
In other words, there are such men who can take it if only they have the necessary motivation.
As you know, I am soon to arrive to my fiance, Yana. Changing countries with all the necessary paperwork, wrapping up a kind of large place in preparation of its sale, which is already listed, moving pets, and coordinating all other matters is a full-time job. Exhausting.
And even doing these tasks with vigilance is a huge sign of reliability to effectively handle other problems under duress. For example, a child has an accident. A lot of stress. How does he handle it? Exactly how? And all girls who imagine you as their lifetime man will measure any man during courtship for signs which can show that his love of physical pleasure is matched by his understanding of his role as “man” within the marriage.
Money has a purpose in all things. And insofar as girls and most people for that matter like many material goods, the real bar of “necessary” wealth is found in answering the call of actual living costs. Housing, food, communications, transportation, clothing, entertainment and so on. This is the Real bar and not precisely one late model car over another.
In this maxim of “my husband, my lover, my friend” ‘friend’ is intended to imply reliably and effectively answers the true cost bar of life. A friend in the storm of life in other words.
Most girls who “get it” will work with any man they truly love when he is of sound character and shows true and obvious potential. This is the good faith part of love.
Some Russian girls will be so lost in the euphoria of love, that finally they have their good man, that practical matters may not be anywhere on the map of “primary” concerns in the establishment period of the relationship.
Interesting, it has consistently been me who became pre-occupied with “husband the sole provider” well before my fiance. For her, permanent unification has consistently and entirely been her obsession.
So while she suffered thoughts of uniting, I had already gone into thoughts of pampers, piano, auto, and so on. As soon as I understood that she was spectacularly knowledgeable and devoted in her future role as a mother.
It is this which has motivated me to “turn on the jets” for what has never truly interested me. Purpose.
So, a good Real man’s character, without any character flaw serious enough to end the relationship, the potential to acquire or actually have material wealth sufficient to meet the true bar of living expenses and his devotion to his obligation to make his girl happy in all her personal life necessities is what most traditional girls seek.
Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses as a man. It is his task to fill in the weaknesses with new strengths built on the foundation of his actual, current strenghts achievements. Success even in one area, breeds more success.
And this is the manliness of his ability to “rise to meet his man’s challenges in life” instead of whining like some girlie #$#got.
Someone recently asked me what girls truly want. I answered, “Everything, same as you; but, from a girl’s perspective.”
So, begin already, or simply turn on the television and zone out on someone else’s 100,000 per episode success.
A Russian girl will love you for your manliness. And this manliness without equivocation will, by definition, include his zeal for meeting material needs… happy that he has his love and life which fulfills him.
When a man is truly in love and has found his wife and mother of his child/children the obvious becomes glaringly obvious. I will never be offended by my girl’s discussion of material matters. She is also the first who wants to help me in ways that no other before have. I specifically asked her if she would be my biz partner. This girl and her ability to attract it is truly amazing. The girl with the Midas touch. I have my own personal career ambitions. She needs much less and has consistently told me this. I am pushing her to help. Not her pushing me for “things.” She could care less beyond the Real bar of life.
Imagine, my own personal civil lawyer, agent and contract negotiator. Not too bad considering she is also ‘*soon the be’ “*my wife, my prostitute, my friend.” Prostitute in this context must be correctly understood. It refers to a girl who, when she is truly and passionately in love, desires to fulfill her man’s physical, sexual desires and needs. “You can do whatever you want with me.” A sign of true love when a girl speaks these words.
BTW, in “Casino Royale”, Bond’s girl spoke these words to him. She was clearly deeply in love with him.
Anyone who thinks that a traditional relationship is sexually mundane doesn’t really get it. Hotter than Texas pine tar, my friends. My entire point on the pleasure principle has always been over the issue of degree of cheerful, enthusiastic “desire” and free will willingness. When pleasure follows desire there is not a prostitute in the world who can give what a girl in passionate love can.
And it is also “desire” which can help a man understand that material success is his happy answer to his place in the world and never the most fundamental issue of loveability or drudgery.
Think of it more as a happy man picks up a heavy tree blocking their walking path while holding hands. A tree too heavy for her to lift while carrying your flesh and blood child and kissing you both “before” and after you encountered the man’s tree of life.
Rexpat.
All the best to you on your blog. (I spotted your link so that’s why the name shows as it does from when I access from within.)
socon said
Hello Rexpat
Thanks for contributing, and for the link.
I’ll be posting a bit more of this in a while, and your comments will be welcome.
PS. You can update your screen name and website address on the “Your Profile” tab under “Users”.
Rexpat said
Finally I saw the drop down tab, thanks to you. It was driving my not so techlike self around the bend.
….
It seems the closer it gets the more I need to write. Either that or take up drinking. Or I could do both and do the Hemingway thing. Nah. Not that either. I like adjectives too much.
I look forward to reading your stuff, socon. Have a good one.
And by the way, where do you get the emoticons?
socon said
http://faq.wordpress.com/2006/06/04/what-smilies-can-i-use/
Rexpat said
Thank you for taking the time.
Rexpat.
Ceiver said
Socon, Rexpat…my fellow SNOBS
I received an email from my FSU lady who has returned to her country…her one line was reward
“I always felt protected in your home, always felt some calmness was there, that I was missing”.
nothing about money!
high noon …haynes hall
Rexpat said
Ceiver.
Sounds like a combination of the snuggle factor and either an open door or a life made “richer”.
Fine girls often keep the company of at least some others somewhat like them.
Bonsai brother.
Rexpat said
My last post for God knows how long.
Something for you to chew on while I’m gone…
http://www.bilderberg.org/
What, you may say does this have to do with establishing a great personal life? Enlightenment and perspective. Who is the real enemy and so on.
Mostly though, when you see enough garbage, the gift of a true girl’s heart is held much more preciously.
There is so much that “they” do to harm and control. Criminally insane is the only explanation which can make sense.
Mercury poisoning of the population via dental fillings. Introducing simple light bulhs which emit more of it. Vaccines as Nazi hired military weapon creations from Kissinger’s sponsorship now foisted on an unsuspecting world. The hidden disease cure information, including AIDS. The real war on drugs, creating an absolute monopoly. Hertz rate mind control techniques. Secret military operations “against the people”. Free energy systems. The suppression of gas saving devices, and the holding of the 527 patents which could save the world a fortune. Secret child abuse rings. The attack on the greater good of the people of the world.
I need a hug from a real girl. And I know just where to get it.
In my absence, I send my best wishes to the Real men and their girls who pray for you to find them.
socon said
Ceiver: Hello SNOB.
Good to hear
–
Rexpat: All the best
wonderlander said
Goodmoment Socon,
thank you for a view from the West – emphasizing how differences in context make differences in perception. More explanation from the Eastern point now.
FSU economies have reckoned off “family money” for decades. The Communist order started with destroying private wealth, then outlawed entrepreneurship. The privileged (Party bosses and ideologically approved intellectuals) were few, and in danger of losing everything earned or allowed when out of political favor. (Guess what happened to those out of political fashion when the Soviet Union collapsed.) Top doctors and officials could but take bribes; embezzlement was for industry managers; and the law enforcement was stricter than now. Enrichment started growing, from underground, in the 80’s, so the “guilded children” here are barely older than 25. Mostly, we can witness first-generation wealth.
Soviet savings could only be made in the State-owned bank or (persecutably) under the mattress. Systemic bankruptcy and drastic inflation annihilated them. (I had a book published in 1991; on the date of contract, the fee was worth a car; on the payment date, it shrunk to a pair of earrings.) In the new capitalist era, racket, raids and bank / stock crises followed.
As the result, in Russia et al., money is about making, not saving. Which requires energy and boldness. How much virtue’s added, that’s the question. Largely, the question of time. Development of economy broadens clean opportunities to earn with one’s own mind. The younger get the quicker start, my peers outracing their parents’ current achievement.
For a Russian man, the “gauging age” has always been 30. By that age it is clear what he’s done and what he’s capable of, and 40 is the landmark of full fruition. Complete school education ends at 17-18, college takes 5 years (rarely 6 now, 7 – for doctors), cross out 2-3 years more if you were caught into the military (and got “seasoned” not broken there). Years of work experience as an employee? Entrepreneurs who win walk out on the rules; they find where the profit is, and waste no time, just like Russian immigrant Sergey Brin. Some reach big money at the corporate ladder, though. Few of them all bother about MBA, “scholastics outside the Russian school of life”.
Mozart. Lermontov. Einstein. Alexander the Great. Talents of all fields burst into bloom early. (In search of some link, I found this provocative read…
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/ideas/articles/2003/08/17/do_scientists_age_badly/ )
On the other hand, I won’t dare gainsay the vitality / virility of older men (or they pepper us with stones). After all, intellectual power is the successor of physical power in the modern world. Even females understand it from the bottom of their everything. Whatever question you ask a Russian woman about the traits she prefers in men, she’ll start with “clever”.
As for the “middle class examples”, we trust Western men to be free of Russian flaws, such as dishonest wealth and manifestation outweighing worth. Thus, a more expensive design is construed as a part of a more comfy and bright lifestyle in general. John and Olga would face disappointment. But so may Steve, shouting “You should spend less!” and hearing “You should earn more!” in reply. See above.
Best regards,
Comrade Natalia
socon said
Welcome Natalie, and thank you for your response.
You have brought up a number of issues that I had intended to address in Part 2 of this article, which I never got down to writing. In any case, I’ll address them here in this comment.
By the way, your point about differing cultural contexts is well taken. A simple example of this came up recently… GL told Luke that he should always pay for a Russian (well, in this case, Polish) girl’s meal in a dating or even regular social setting, even if the girl refuses his initially offer of payment…
GL interprets it (correctly, in my opinion) as a test by the girl of his sincerity, trust, confidence as a Man, leadership, etc…
Luke of course whined that he refused to be “tested”, was not interested in head games, whatever…
Now although Luke is wrong here, his position is totally understandable, given the Cultural Context he is coming from. A “test” by a typical western[ised] female, especially of the present generation, is all about “how much can I milk him for money” or “how far can I push him… manipulate him… in order to establish my –power- over him and boost my fragile ego”, etc. (And Natalie, with due respect, I don’t believe you fully appreciate how insidious, evil, and hurtful these kinds of females are, and how almost Universal this behaviour has become.)
Anyway, compare this typically-Western type of “testing” with the testing that will be done by a (good) Eastern girl who wishes to gauge a Man’s integrity, sincerity, confidence, etc. The superficial differences between these two types of tests seem subtle, but I’m sure you’ll agree that the underlying intents are worlds apart. Cultural Context.
Back to the issue of money…
You said:
” Soviet savings could only be made in the State-owned bank or (persecutably) under the mattress. Systemic bankruptcy and drastic inflation annihilated them. (I had a book published in 1991; on the date of contract, the fee was worth a car; on the payment date, it shrunk to a pair of earrings.) In the new capitalist era, racket, raids and bank / stock crises followed.
As the result, in Russia et al., money is about making, not saving.”
Thank you for this. It does clarify a lot. And personally, I love the idea of enjoying life when young, rather than the Western method of saving up to (maybe) enjoy life when you finally retire at 60.
However, my original point, made in the original post still stands, ie. In the West, there is a very low correlation between material wealth and greater virtues. Regardless of how strongly these may correlate in Russia or not.
“Entrepreneurs who win walk out on the rules; they find where the profit is, and waste no time, just like Russian immigrant Sergey Brin. Some reach big money at the corporate ladder, though. Few of them all bother about MBA, “scholastics outside the Russian school of life”.
Mozart. Lermontov. Einstein. Alexander the Great. Talents of all fields burst into bloom early. (In search of some link, I found this provocative read…”
Yes, true. But these represent a vanishingly small minority of Men. Last I checked, there were something like 120 000 women from the FSU seeking husbands abroad. And there are many, many good, adequately accomplished Men seeking them as well.
You’re likely to find maybe 5 men for fit the profile of Einstein, Google boys, etc. What I speak of is the mass of, like I said before, adequately accomplished Men. Many of them with potential for even more than adequate accomplishment (though not at the level of Einstein, et. al), which, as a general rule, begins after the age of 35.
Some of the “requirements” you seem to set come across as ridiculously elitist and unrealistic, even to many of the most conservative of Western Men. And even the most accomplished ones.
” Whatever question you ask a Russian woman about the traits she prefers in men, she’ll start with “clever”.”
You have NO IDEA how endearing this is to anyone coming from this stupidity-worshipping Western culture.
I would hope that “clever” is respected as a virtue in itself though, not just as a means of getting rich?
“As for the “middle class examples”, we trust Western men to be free of Russian flaws, such as dishonest wealth…”
Naïve. I am not American myself, but I know a good deal more about the business climate there than you do. You said in your original article that an American man once said that it is easy to get rich is the U.S… “just work hard and be nice to people.” Maybe 20 years ago. Not now. Now it’s much more often a case of… “just be corrupt, and bully people.” Same true for most other places.
“and manifestation outweighing worth”
Not so much of a flaw or an attempt at wilful misrepresentation, as a norm of society. Everything on credit. Almost everyone does it. Again, cultural context.
“Thus, a more expensive design is construed as a part of a more comfy and bright lifestyle in general”
It’s a sign of ostentation. No more, no less. Not to say there’s anything wrong with that, if that’s what you go for. But don’t link it to anything greater. Maybe in Russia. Maybe. Not in the contemporary West.
“John and Olga would face disappointment. But so may Steve, shouting “You should spend less!” and hearing “You should earn more!” in reply. See above.””
Well, there’s really no third alternative to John or Steve. Frankly, this attitude comes across as horribly unrealistic, demanding, and elitist. Especially given the fact that the overwhelming majority of FSU people are rather poor by Western standards.
This attitude will have good, thinking Western Men turn 180 degrees, burn down the house, and head straight for Thailand. Even many of the the richest and most accomplished of them.
Think about it. The uber-rich & accomplished guy in the West can get one of the few young, (physically) attractive females from his own country. The only reason such a Man would go to Russia would be to find someone with better character and values (which is the main thing that sets Eastern women apart) etc. than what he would get locally. Not spoilt females and golddiggers. Plenty of those at home, and accessible to him.
More in a while. Your continued contributions are most welcome.
Luke Skywalker said
Okay Socon,
Both GL and Rexpat have written at one time or another that traditional women test men.
First, I refuted him by saying that I talked to people who had lived in the Philippines for a long time, and who had lived in the rural US for a long time, and getting their opinions. And they said that there are Philippine women that do not test men, and that there are women from the rural US don’t test men, either.
And then GL turned around and said that it was only Russian and Polish women that he was talking about, not all traditional women.
Socon, how would you know about these supposed tests? Do you know them because you’ve actually been to Poland, or is this just something you’re repeating because GL told you so?
GL has only lived in Russia for 4 years, but he professes to know how not only all Russian women are going to behave, but how all Polish women will, when Poland is a country that he hasn’t even been to.
Socon, even the statement that all Western women are superficial and want to test men to see how much money they want to milk out of men is wrong.
So how can you make a blanket statement that all Russian and Polish women test men, in the context that GL was referring to, when you’ve only been in Russia for 4 years, and you haven’t been to Poland at all. Answer: You can’t.
And when all else failed, he turned to the argument that the tests were “invisible”, so thus I couldn’t detect them. That’s actually an even weaker argument, because it sets up an unprovable hypothesis. That’s almost like me saying that there’s an invisible monster under my bed, and that nobody can see it because it’s “invisible”, but it’s there anyway because you can’t prove that it’s not there.
Luke Skywalker said
Now you’re starting to see things my way, aren’t you Socon.
Good, that’s progress.
You see Socon, the more people that worship these Russian women, and the more people that put them on a pedestal, the more they start to act like American women. They start to have “horribly unrealistic, demanding, and elitist” demands. Just like American women do.
Case in point is Natalia here… For the last year, people (read: American men) have been praising her left and right for almost every little thing she says, just because she is a Ukrainian woman. And now we see the result of that, don’t we Socon. The result is the “horribly unrealistic, demanding, and elitist” attitude that you saw just now.
Luke Skywalker said
edit: When I said ‘American men’ I meant ‘Western men’.
socon said
Luke:
“Socon, how would you know about these supposed tests? Do you know them because you’ve actually been to Poland, or is this just something you’re repeating because GL told you so?”
I have not been to Russia or Poland. I am repeating what GL said. However, what GL said makes sense to me. I would certainly test a girl to gauge her sincerity, and would expect the same.
In fact, I would be concerned if I wasn’t tested in some way. I would view it as a sign of her either not having a serious attitude to me, or of her being very naive.
“Socon, even the statement that all Western women are superficial and want to test men to see how much money they want to milk out of men is wrong.”
Don’t be pedantic. I never said “all”. I said “typically”. We always speak in generalities when discussing these issues. This is nothing new.
“Now you’re starting to see things my way, aren’t you Socon.
Good, that’s progress.”
Ermmm, no. Not your way. Sorry.
“Case in point is Natalia here… [etc, etc...]“
Can we please defer judgement until she gives her perspective on this?
wonderlander said
Thanks for good hosting and again for explanations, I definitely need to share them around. )
…Sure, “clever” is a virtue in itself and in the whole spectrum of other virtues. Whatever you guess may turn a woman on: “Serious or humorous? – Clever!” “Decent or bold? – Clever!” “Lavish or thrifty? – Clever!” etc., etc.
In this context, the word describes a multifaceted person and a perceptive decisionmaker, who shines different virtues at different moments, adequately. (If this may be difficult, then the couple is supposed to be able to talk and cope. We seek a “good spouse” to be a “best friend”, and “friendship” implies “constructive conversation”.)
There’s a cute Russian women’s joke: “Main male sexual organ (var.: “erogenous zone” / “most attractive part”), 4 letters? – MIND.”
… Exaggeration being one of Russian traits, how could I avoid quoting best-known examples of early accomplishments, to illustrate a more common trend explored in the article I linked to. Especially when a Russian name comes handy.
So, relax, folks! Who said the Google boys are a “requirement”? They are not my type, to begin with. And Albert is alas no more. (Did this joke sound a joke, American way?))
What I was speaking about, is skipping conventional schedules, like education and work experience. Which is evidently less possible, and thought of, in an established, structured society that the West turned into (but most of us “here” get the news about “there” with great delay). And which is how the race is run in economies newly shaken and stirred into capitalism.
I’d mention here that people had to grasp opportunities at whatever age the Transition has caught them. Some missed their chance because of being too old to change, some because of being too young to matter to the surrounding world.
…Unfortunately, in Russia money is rather associated with crime and depravity. This history has been the history of poverty, preset by harsh natural conditions, sanctified by the Orthodox religion, normatized by communities that trode down hard on individuals who dared to differ from the mass, since Empire-time villages and into Soviet-state policy. Thus, breaking the rules too often meant breaking the law – imagine what mentality is required and forged in such a context. This makes most wealthy Russian men poor husband material… more darts to be flung at, later.
…Also the poverty background brings about a degree of “compensational urge”. For what I’ve learned, Eastern European women’s demands are in any case way more reasonable than those of their Western counterparts. But this gives no grounds to assume that better characters and values can be a cheap deal, as many seekers unfortunately do.
And guess what: our women choose Western men exactly for their attitude and manners that Luke calls “worship”. Here it is called “knowing how to treat a woman”.
An average member of a dating site or introductions agency gets more than one hundred letters from men within her first week of exposure. Many international brides become registered at several services. Russian Brides forums witness that a woman’s search may continue for several years. “Picky Bride” is a timeless archetype of Russian folklore.
My own degree of “spoiledness” has settled longer ago than to depend on compliments or boo’s. Since I ever started blogging, my credo was, “let’em hate Natalia for telling the unpleasant truth, rather than hate each other for not knowing it”. Some of my statements became even milder as I got to know more about the Western society (thanks to everyone I heard!), and foreseeing this, I’ve been keeping many topics in drafts for re-editing. On the other hand, I can speak up on more sensitive matters now that the audience is prepared. Here is one of such posts.
http://russianwomenspeak.wordpress.com/2007/11/01/is-russian-ukrainian-wife-an-economy-solution-cheap-maintenance-benefits-costs-risks/
Sincerely, Comrade Natalia.
Luke Skywalker said
Yeah, that’s what it was called in the West a long time ago, too. And guess what it evolved into. It evolved into spoiled brat syndrome, it evolved into entitlement princess syndrome, and worst of all, it evolved into society’s belief that males are inherently worth less than females, a belief that is not only damaging in and of itself, but also the grounds for a whole lot of further misandry.
wonderlander said
So far, misandry in the FSU exists only in response to brutish and brattish attitudes from the men’s part. Oppositely, respectful, confident and chivalrous men receive most natural admiration. The guys well-acquainted with Russian women’s mentality would testify, “Treat her like a princess and be treated like a king.”
socon said
Natalie…
Thanks for clarifying the issues. The more we discuss them, the more our sense of mutual understanding grows. Making for fewer misunderstandings later on.
Luke…
“Here it is called “knowing how to treat a woman”.
Yeah, that’s what it was called in the West a long time ago, too. And guess what it evolved into. It evolved into spoiled brat syndrome, it evolved into entitlement princess syndrome, [etc etc]”
I disagree that treating women well has caused that.
I believe that various manifestations of Cultural Marxism has caused that, and its propagation via the legal system, academia, and (arguably most influentially) the mainstream media.
Rexpat said
It is rare a man who never leads with his money in the hunt for love. Somewhere near to the rarity of a man being loved simply for himself.
I have seen it and said it over and over again…
Lead with your bank account and get taken to the cleaners.
Lead with your character, your heart and get at least a fighting chance at love. I would go so far as to say it is only a truly successful man who can purposely softpedal his material wealth until his emotional well-being allows it after extremely careful screening of the ever-disingenuous hunters.
“But I’ve got material wealth and I promise she loves me!”… Oh yeah. And you lead–past tense and probably present too– with it too when first you met because you didn’t have enough confidence in all the other masculine, mannish characteristics. So, expect to find her “experimenting” with other guys after she’s installed herself on the onramp to material security just before she divorces you.
Women and their stages. Including the sexually hyperactive 30-40 range where variety can overwhelm fidelity commitmenta when a true bond of love is absent.
Go ahead, follow the weakest link in the chain of emotional, relationship security. Lead with your money.
It is a wise man who says little about ALL his assets if he hopes to always keep his @su from being taken for a ride in family court. Otherwise known as the private investment portfolio. Iceberg technology boys. In family law economics 101, prevention is 9/10ths of the law. The other 1/10th is in the courtroom.
Do women like this? Gee, what do you think? Being in love doesn’t have to mean overexposing your ass-ets.